One does not do a TRANSFER of the TIAA Traditional from an RA, and I assume from a GRA; one creates a TPA. The TPA is created as a separate account. Where the annual distribution goes is up to the participant of the TPA; it could be to an IRA or I assume the funds could be sent outside of T-C. In most cases I suspect the participant elects to have the annual distributions deposited in the IRA; this is what I did when I create mine (I have two) and what Dennis appears to have done. 

One can change the designation where the annual distributions can be deposited at any time. I have not tried to specifiy a destination outside of my T-C IRA and therefore I cannot guarantee that is possible. But I have changed the designation of the annual distributions a couple of times and there is no problem in doing this. The funds remaining in the TPA do retain their vintages as Dennis said. The deposition of the annual distribution from the TPA in as far as I know, destroys the vintages one the funds are distributed including when the annual distribution is placed in the Traditional Account in the IRA; again Dennis is correct.

You can do this at any time and therefore you have lots of choices where to place EACH annual distribution. You can put in in the Traditional Account in the IRA for one or more years, and then change it to the MM Account or the REA or the ILB, etc. And the following year you could change it again. If I remember correctly I have changed it twice in one year! :-)

IF you want to annuitize ANY PART of the funds remaining in the TPA at any time you MUST ANNUITIZE THE TOTAL AMOUNT REMAINING IN THE TPA! Partial annuitizations of funds in the TPA are NOT permitted! Now, if you place the annual distributions into the IRA but in some account other than the Traditional Account, you can annutitize that amount into either a life annuity (single or two live with or without guarantee periods) but also into a TERM Annuity which most people would call a fixed period annuity. As I remember, though it depends on the age of the particpant doing the annuitization, the term period can vary from as little as two years to as much as 30 years.

Nothing Dennis said is incorrect. He just did not fully explain the nuisances.

Oh, one more point, if you have a TPA in place and become subject to RMDs sometime in the nine years and one day life of the TPA you cannot have T-C automatically do RMDs; you in effect have to do them manually yourself but as I (and Sy) have said elsewhere, this is not a big deal. IF you disagree with this statement you are welcome to check on it yourself but I warn you it is a bag of worms; I have been through it and I am convinced I am right on this. 

Ray

When I rolled over a 403(b) TIAA-CREF GSRA to an existing TIAA-CREF IRA in 2005, I was required to fill out a form headed "Request for a Payment".  Much of the form was pre-filled in for me by a rollover expert in Charlotte.  The form repeatedly uses the term "withdrawal" to refer to what's happening to the old accounts.  I don't think I gave that enough thought at the time. But it now seems clear that even though the rollover was within TIAA-CREF, I gave up my vintages in TIAA Traditional.

On the other hand, when TIAA-CREF involuntarily moved my RA after-tax contributions to a new, after-tax account (first ATRA, now RA again), they eventually assured me (when I inquired specifically) that the vintages there had been preserved.

In any case, it's next to impossible to verify any of this, because your statements don't break out holdings and income by vintage. Even if someone isn't making contributions anymore (which slightly simplifies the calculations), taking a starting and ending balance one year apart doesn't provide any way to extract the various interest rates that lead to whatever Rate Of Return (for the total sum, that is) you manage to calculate on the two numbers.

Tim
 

Socrativestor:

:

If one hold TIAA Tradiational in an IRA and later converts some/all of that IRA to a Roth, are the original vintages preserved or is the conversion treated as a sale in the IRA and a new purchase in the Roth?

If you have traditional in an SRA or IRA, then there would be no change in vintages by converting your SRA or IRA to a Roth.

If you have traditional in a RA, then there would be an extra step in the process by using a TPA to move 10% per year into the present vintage of a SRA.... ,thus changing your vintage structure.  

However, do confirm this with T/C before making any of these changes

Dick.

crefwatch:

 

But it now seems clear that even though the rollover was within TIAA-CREF, I gave up my vintages in TIAA Traditional.

In any case, it's next to impossible to verify any of this, because your statements don't break out holdings and income by vintage. 

Would be surprised if you gave up your vintages.  Think you could still verify this as T/C will give you the amounts you have in each vintage with a phone call.  You should have some funds in the vintages prior to your rollover date. 

Around 1999 I converted a SRA to Roth status.

I'm sure I retained all prior vintages, since in 2000 I noticed that all prior vintages in my Roth were less than that of the 2000 vintage.  Thus, I made my first flip at that time.

Dick 

In any case, it's next to impossible to verify any of this, because your statements don't break out holdings and income by vintage. Even if someone isn't making contributions anymore (which slightly simplifies the calculations), taking a starting and ending balance one year apart doesn't provide any way to extract the various interest rates that lead to whatever Rate Of Return (for the total sum, that is) you manage to calculate on the two numbers.

What I do to calculate the rate of return on my Traditional holding (using my calculator)at any time is:

I take the total amount of increase for one day by subtracting it from the previous day;

I divide it by the previous days' total amount in the Traditional account;

I hit the % key on my calculator (which gives me one days' rate of return);

I multiply the result by 365 (days in the year) and presto! I have the Yearly rate of Return.

It's a little funky, but it's pretty darn close.

Sy

syplatt:

What I do to calculate the rate of return on my Traditional holding....

T/C will give you the present rate of return with a phone call.  Except for very minor adjustments due to reinvestments of interest, this should hold steady until they made vintage changes.

Would be interested in how close your method matches T/C's number. 

Dick 

Would be interested in how close your method matches T/C's number.

It's pretty close. I used to call once in a while to get it as you suggest, but I'd rather not call unless there's something more important to talk about. My method always comes out a little bit less than the percentage suggests, but that may be due to compounding that I can't figure in. But I do accurately forecast how many dollars it will advance each day or week.

I like that a whole lot better than trying to figure out how long its going to take me to get back to square one on my equity funds, even though it's boring. I can't even remember when I made anything on equities; that is; for the last 8 years. Only TREA worked for me since Spring of 2000.

Sy

syplatt:

Would be interested in how close your method matches T/C's number.

It's pretty close. I used to call once in a while to get it as you suggest, but I'd rather not call unless there's something more important to talk about. My method always comes out a little bit less than the percentage suggests, but that may be due to compounding that I can't figure in. But I do accurately forecast how many dollars it will advance each day or week.

I like that a whole lot better than trying to figure out how long its going to take me to get back to square one on my equity funds, even though it's boring. I can't even remember when I made anything on equities; that is; for the last 8 years. Only TREA worked for me since Spring of 2000.

Sy

Sy,

Instead of multiplying by 325, just raise the daily rate by 325, like:

[(1+daily rate)^365] - 1 = yearly rate.

- Alec